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  1. #11
    Advisor to Bum Wanabees Pipe Smoker's Avatar
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    Dunhill pipes are oil-cured, rather than air-cured. The advantage of that is that they smoke sweet from the first pipeful. My group 2 Dunhill Liverpool did. But, after break-in, my other good briars smoke just as fine as the Dunhill. And my inexpensive aluminum-stem Kirsten Mariner is the sweetest-smoking pipe I own.
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  2. #12
    True Derelict NeverBend's Avatar  Cigar Bum Sponsor
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    Quote Originally Posted by Haebar View Post
    ...a tobacconist in Nashville, told me of the many steps in the manufacturing process, some of which were trade secrets. He told me that one of the secrets was boiling the bowls in whale head oil, something that is no longer readily obtainable. It made sense to me.


    Hi Tab,

    Even inexpensive bucket pipes take many manufacturing steps to complete. Dunhill makes their stems from rod vulcanite, think old style bowling ball material, that adds process time but it makes for an exceptional stem. In all the factories that I've been to there's nothing secretive about Dunhill's process other than that they've been buying stummels (unfinished bowls) from other manufacturers since the beginning of their pipe history.

    Alfred Dunhill patented everything and anything and he did hold a patent on oil curing. I saw the patent some time in the past but not sure if it called for Whale Oil.

    Dunhill is, and always has been a marketing company. Their success can be measured in their 'mystique'.


    Quote Originally Posted by Pipe Smoker View Post
    Dunhill pipes are oil-cured, rather than air-cured. The advantage of that is that they smoke sweet from the first pipeful. My group 2 Dunhill Liverpool did. But, after break-in, my other good briars smoke just as fine as the Dunhill. And my inexpensive aluminum-stem Kirsten Mariner is the sweetest-smoking pipe I own.


    Hi Doug,

    My response to you and Tab could be a book and my intent is not to attack Dunhill, rather to weigh in on what I know factually about pipe manufacturing process, theirs and in general, but much of the answer is in my statement that they're a marketing company.

    Whether oil (Dunhill and Ashton) or heat (Sasieni) curing, any additional process beyond proper air curing is meaningless in producing superior smoking pipes and may be harmful. Romantically, it's nice to think of some special process that a company does to make their pipes smoke better but the answer is to buy better briar in the first place. To understand this in context would require a really long discussion about the acquisition of the briar and how it's handled at the saw mill and the physical properties of briar, so I'll summarize;

    Billy Taylor worked for Dunhill and created the Ashton pipe with Dave Field. They devised their own oil curing process, similar to Dunhill. Billy stated that it took several bowls to eliminate the taste of the oil and that's consistent with Dunhill. Sasieni held, I believe, a patent on 'baking' their briar and there are stories that you they had people wipe the moisture off the blocks as they baked.

    Briar is NOT the root of the heath bush (erica arborea), as most believe, rather it's a tumor that grows off of the root stem. Briar grows outward, away from the root stem, so that the oldest wood is the edge of the burl. Every briar burl contains wood that is as new as the day it was dug and as old as the tumor. Older briar has less pulp (that retains moisture) and resin and it has more defined xylem (grain). Briar grows in arid climates, in sandy and or rocky soil and the tumor is a moisture reservoir. Xylem transfers moisture to the pulp that’s nearer the root stem to aid in the plant's survival but that makes the inside wood (pulp) less desirable for smoking quality.

    Diggers harvest burls and bring them to the sawmill where they're cut, boiled (to remove resins, etc.) and then cut again to shape and remove serious flaws. The mill cutters attempt to retain larger, unshaped blocks, from the outside of the burl (plateaux) and that's their most expensive product, normally used by hand makers, while the inner blocks are cut into ebauchons, shaped for use in machine production.

    All briar must be air dried and the quality of the drying process is critical for making better pipes but time is money to the saw mills and the premier product, plateaux, is dried longer than ebauchons. The only process that can improve the briar is to air dry it more, anything else is a gimmick or marketing tool and there is no shortcut. Heat (Sasieni) causes fissures. Oil clogs xylem that will retain dust that will take time to smoke out. A honey/water solution in the tobacco chamber can help take off the harsh 'woody' edge off a new bowl.

    Thus, controlling your briar supply and using the best briar, plateaux, makes the best pipes. Barling owned their own sawmill in Algeria and, like Dunhill, they made their stems from NY Hamburger rod vulcanite (different blend than Dunhill) so that, as I've said for 35 years, they controlled their quality from 'Ground to Mouth'. Even so well intended there are some poor smoking Barlings.

    This is why I always make the distinction between hand and machine made pipes because the latter can't use plateaux (it's not shaped). The difference in process gives hand made pipes a decided edge - as long as they use properly handled plateaux because beautiful and extravagant hand shaping can't make a bad piece of briar smoke well.

    Regards,

    Pete

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  4. #13
    Royal Bum droy1958's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NeverBend View Post

    Hi Tab,

    Even inexpensive bucket pipes take many manufacturing steps to complete. Dunhill makes their stems from rod vulcanite, think old style bowling ball material, that adds process time but it makes for an exceptional stem. In all the factories that I've been to there's nothing secretive about Dunhill's process other than that they've been buying stummels (unfinished bowls) from other manufacturers since the beginning of their pipe history.

    Alfred Dunhill patented everything and anything and he did hold a patent on oil curing. I saw the patent some time in the past but not sure if it called for Whale Oil.

    Dunhill is, and always has been a marketing company. Their success can be measured in their 'mystique'.




    Hi Doug,

    My response to you and Tab could be a book and my intent is not to attack Dunhill, rather to weigh in on what I know factually about pipe manufacturing process, theirs and in general, but much of the answer is in my statement that they're a marketing company.

    Whether oil (Dunhill and Ashton) or heat (Sasieni) curing, any additional process beyond proper air curing is meaningless in producing superior smoking pipes and may be harmful. Romantically, it's nice to think of some special process that a company does to make their pipes smoke better but the answer is to buy better briar in the first place. To understand this in context would require a really long discussion about the acquisition of the briar and how it's handled at the saw mill and the physical properties of briar, so I'll summarize;

    Billy Taylor worked for Dunhill and created the Ashton pipe with Dave Field. They devised their own oil curing process, similar to Dunhill. Billy stated that it took several bowls to eliminate the taste of the oil and that's consistent with Dunhill. Sasieni held, I believe, a patent on 'baking' their briar and there are stories that you they had people wipe the moisture off the blocks as they baked.

    Briar is NOT the root of the heath bush (erica arborea), as most believe, rather it's a tumor that grows off of the root stem. Briar grows outward, away from the root stem, so that the oldest wood is the edge of the burl. Every briar burl contains wood that is as new as the day it was dug and as old as the tumor. Older briar has less pulp (that retains moisture) and resin and it has more defined xylem (grain). Briar grows in arid climates, in sandy and or rocky soil and the tumor is a moisture reservoir. Xylem transfers moisture to the pulp that’s nearer the root stem to aid in the plant's survival but that makes the inside wood (pulp) less desirable for smoking quality.

    Diggers harvest burls and bring them to the sawmill where they're cut, boiled (to remove resins, etc.) and then cut again to shape and remove serious flaws. The mill cutters attempt to retain larger, unshaped blocks, from the outside of the burl (plateaux) and that's their most expensive product, normally used by hand makers, while the inner blocks are cut into ebauchons, shaped for use in machine production.

    All briar must be air dried and the quality of the drying process is critical for making better pipes but time is money to the saw mills and the premier product, plateaux, is dried longer than ebauchons. The only process that can improve the briar is to air dry it more, anything else is a gimmick or marketing tool and there is no shortcut. Heat (Sasieni) causes fissures. Oil clogs xylem that will retain dust that will take time to smoke out. A honey/water solution in the tobacco chamber can help take off the harsh 'woody' edge off a new bowl.

    Thus, controlling your briar supply and using the best briar, plateaux, makes the best pipes. Barling owned their own sawmill in Algeria and, like Dunhill, they made their stems from NY Hamburger rod vulcanite (different blend than Dunhill) so that, as I've said for 35 years, they controlled their quality from 'Ground to Mouth'. Even so well intended there are some poor smoking Barlings.

    This is why I always make the distinction between hand and machine made pipes because the latter can't use plateaux (it's not shaped). The difference in process gives hand made pipes a decided edge - as long as they use properly handled plateaux because beautiful and extravagant hand shaping can't make a bad piece of briar smoke well.

    Regards,

    Pete
    That's what I was going to say...
    Like my father before me, I will work the land,
    And like my brother before me, I took a rebel stand.

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  6. #14
    Royal Bum Cool Breeze's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by droy1958 View Post
    That's what I was going to say...
    Took the words right out of your mouth didn't he? lol

    I never dreamed I would get this much information when I posed my question. Thanks a lot guys.
    Check out my Youtube channel, Razorback Piper Guy if you like that sort of thing.
    https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCDM...i44pRZ4AP-_1OA

    If heaven has no cigars, I shall not go there. - Mark Twain

    It has been my experience that folks who have no vices, have very few virtues. - Abraham Lincoln

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  8. #15
    True Derelict NeverBend's Avatar  Cigar Bum Sponsor
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    Gents,

    There are several videos on the Net that show part of the briar mill process that are either incomplete or out of sequence but these two are good (view in sequence):

    Mimmo - Briar Saw Mill
    Mimmo with finished blocks



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