Bringing your own sticks to a B&M

Golden Leaf in downtown St Paul has a similar policy and needless to say the place is constantly empty. The owner is a real peach too...

There are a handful of B&Ms around the cities that I frequent regularly that never have an issue if I just stroll in and light up. Ive bought a ton from them over the years, shoot the shit with 'em on the regular and have even helped them set up for events and such. We have a solid relationship. Ive traded and exchanged freebies with them much like I do here and elsewhere online. They know I like to rest my smokes for a bit so they dont enforce a "buy it now, smoke it now" policy on me, those types of places are definitely in the minority and I try to avoid them. Of course if Im going someplace for the first time I will buy it there and smoke it there, pay to play, and first impression is everything.

On the flip side of this discussion, personally I wouldn't think of walking into a shop or lounge and lighting my own stick. That's like walking into restaurant with a dozen eggs and slab of bacon, and asking them to cook them up so you can eat them there. These establishments aren't there to provide you with a free place to get comfortable and smoke. They're there to sell cigars and accessories. That's what pays for that comfy leather chair and air conditioning we all enjoy. If you're spending a hundred or so a month, good for you. If you're buying one or two sticks once a month, then you're probably not doing them any favors. Is my favorite lounge a bit more expensive than buying online? Sure. But can i walk into my favorite online sites, grab a chair, order a drink, light up, and enjoy some good peraonal contact and discussion? Nope. So everything is a trade off. I want to save money, I buy online. When I want some face time with people who share similar interests, I go to town and buy my sticks there.

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Originally Posted by Demuths1770

thats what they did! they put a minium purachase of buying a cigar??!!?? thats better than having a month purchase requiremnet because you chase away customers that come in and just buy afew sticks. its better to have a buy a stick smoke a stick policy which is what they have done

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I think you misunderstood me. I actually think a minimum overall purchase (cigars or beer) would be better than trying to police what everyone is smoking. If I spend $10-15 on beer, it shouldn't matter if I buy a cigar. They're still getting my money.

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Originally Posted by omahaorange

I think we need to look at the whole picture. How long has this place been in business? How many patrons does he have at any given time? Is it usually crowded, or are there plenty of empty seats? The op states he buys boxes, but what kind and how many? Keep in mind it takes volume to keep the lights on. A consistently half-filled room probably spells a losing proposition. The primary reason for their existence is to make money. If the public doesn't cooperate by buying enough to make it worthwhile, then it's time to cut costs.

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Place has been open for almost 2 years. Sometimes there's only 3-5 guys in there, sometimes it's packed.
I've only bought 3 boxes there, I think. Not a lot, I know, but I'll buy a few here and there when I go.
If the public doesn't cooperate, you don't punish them. That's what I feel about this policy. Like that saying "The beatings will continue until morale improves." I just feel like there's a better way to increase sales. A happy medium for those that want to smoke their own cigars and enjoy the ambiance.

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Originally Posted by Ropey

Sounds like OP's cigar lounge is pretty close to going out of business. If a place starts treating regulars like crap to get more money out of them, then the proprietors are thinking short-term, which indicates they have a cash flow problem that has to be handled immediately. And that's never a good sign for a business.

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I hope not, I DO like this place. However, the owner and manager have always thought short-term. We'll see, I guess.

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Originally Posted by Rocket Scientologist

I think you misunderstood me. I actually think a minimum overall purchase (cigars or beer) would be better than trying to police what everyone is smoking. If I spend $10-15 on beer, it shouldn't matter if I buy a cigar. They're still getting my money.

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so the place is not a true bar correct?? are drink prices resonable or too high?? I am gonna go on a limb and say selling drinks dose not make him as much money as it dose a true bar and he dose it to help the regulars out. for shits and giggles lets say he is getting a case of beer at the same price you can and thats 24 dollars for 24 bottles. now he turns around and sells them to you at 2.50 a bottle. he only makes 1.50$ for every bottle. for 15 dollars you get 6 millers and he makes 9$ dollars not to bad. the kicker is while drinking you smoked 3 (im usuall a 2 drink to a cigar guy) 10-12 dollar sticks. with what i have heard from my local shops they make usually 4 dollars on a stick of that cost. thats 12 dollars. if you buy sticks to replace what you smoked and drinks he made 21$ off you instead of 9$. im not trying to argue or anything just saying that if you dont give his money maker the time of day he dose not make money and the doors close. a stick per stick you smoke i dont think is a bad thing at all. as time goes on regulars will probably be allowed to slide on that rule. IMO just be thankful you have a lounge close buy to enjoy and support them if thats what you want to do because some people dont have a local lounge or if they do its a huge membership fee to use it.

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Originally Posted by Demuths1770

so the place is not a true bar correct?? are drink prices resonable or too high?? I am gonna go on a limb and say selling drinks dose not make him as much money as it dose a true bar and he dose it to help the regulars out. for shits and giggles lets say he is getting a case of beer at the same price you can and thats 24 dollars for 24 bottles. now he turns around and sells them to you at 2.50 a bottle. he only makes 1.50$ for every bottle. for 15 dollars you get 6 millers and he makes 9$ dollars not to bad. the kicker is while drinking you smoked 3 (im usuall a 2 drink to a cigar guy) 10-12 dollar sticks. with what i have heard from my local shops they make usually 4 dollars on a stick of that cost. thats 12 dollars. if you buy sticks to replace what you smoked and drinks he made 21$ off you instead of 9$. im not trying to argue or anything just saying that if you dont give his money maker the time of day he dose not make money and the doors close. a stick per stick you smoke i dont think is a bad thing at all. as time goes on regulars will probably be allowed to slide on that rule. IMO just be thankful you have a lounge close buy to enjoy and support them if thats what you want to do because some people dont have a local lounge or if they do its a huge membership fee to use it.

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You're right, it's not a true bar, but he does get the alcohol from a distributor at wholesale prices, so he's not paying what we'd pay. And some beer is cheap - Bud, Miller, etc is $2-3. The beer I had yesterday (New Belgium 1554) was $4.50. A (plastic) glass of bourbon was $10, typical bar pour. His profit margin is larger on alcohol than cigars, I've asked.

Oh, the replacement cigar doesn't have to be equal value. If I smoke a $10-12 stick, I could buy his cheapest cigar as the replacement (Quorum, Flor de Oliva, or his $5 clearance cigars, for example). So how much more money is he making that way?

I'll comply with the policy, but I won't be buying any more boxes there. And since I'll have to spend more buying cigars (because I don't want Quorums), I'll probably start bringing a coffee or coke with me and not buy beer. At least until they institute a no outside food/drink policy.

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Originally Posted by Rocket Scientologist

You're right, it's not a true bar, but he does get the alcohol from a distributor at wholesale prices, so he's not paying what we'd pay. And some beer is cheap - Bud, Miller, etc is $2-3. The beer I had yesterday (New Belgium 1554) was $4.50. A (plastic) glass of bourbon was $10, typical bar pour. His profit margin is larger on alcohol than cigars, I've asked.

Oh, the replacement cigar doesn't have to be equal value. If I smoke a $10-12 stick, I could buy his cheapest cigar as the replacement (Quorum, Flor de Oliva, or his $5 clearance cigars, for example). So how much more money is he making that way?

I'll comply with the policy, but I won't be buying any more boxes there. And since I'll have to spend more buying cigars (because I don't want Quorums), I'll probably start bringing a coffee or coke with me and not buy beer. At least until they institute a no outside food/drink policy.

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he is making the money because you are still buying a cigar from them. i know personally at our lougne we all normally only buy boxes at the events and get a hand full of singles when we just use the lounge. i personally dont mind grabbing sticks when i smoke my own because its usually just to replenish the stash. only reason i like smoking my own is because of the way i store my sticks at a lower RH. Thats just the way i do it because i love to make sure i have a stock at home for aging/smoking.

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Originally Posted by Demuths1770

Only reason i like smoking my own is because of the way i store my sticks at a lower RH. Thats just the way i do it because i love to make sure i have a stock at home for aging/smoking.

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Agreed.

The policy just started so I'll update later with any developments. I was there yesterday without incident. I had been meaning to stop by to get the Camacho ABA so I was going to buy one anyway.

Side note: I smoked La Historia by EP Carrillo and wow that's a nice cigar. Burn was a little wavy and the ash seemed flaky, but a really smooth smoke.

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Originally Posted by Rocket Scientologist

I think you misunderstood me. I actually think a minimum overall purchase (cigars or beer) would be better than trying to police what everyone is smoking. If I spend $10-15 on beer, it shouldn't matter if I buy a cigar. They're still getting my money.



Place has been open for almost 2 years. Sometimes there's only 3-5 guys in there, sometimes it's packed.
I've only bought 3 boxes there, I think. Not a lot, I know, but I'll buy a few here and there when I go.
If the public doesn't cooperate, you don't punish them. That's what I feel about this policy. Like that saying "The beatings will continue until morale improves." I just feel like there's a better way to increase sales. A happy medium for those that want to smoke their own cigars and enjoy the ambiance.



I hope not, I DO like this place. However, the owner and manager have always thought short-term. We'll see, I guess.

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Couple things...
First, do you actually know what his profit margin on alcohol is, or are you assuming he gets it cheap because he's a business? He may simply be selling the booze at cost to enhance his primary business, which I take is selling cigars. Beer and booze could be an enticement only to fill the chairs and sell cigars. Case in point, aeromedical evacuation. The hospital-sponsored helicopters consistently lose money. They are expensive to operate. But that same hospital makes millions when those critical patients brought in by the helicopter spend the time in their operating room and ICU, and go through them for follow up care and rehabilitation.

Two, you bought 3 boxes in two years? So how much do you really think he's made off your business? Keep in mind if the majority of his customers buy only a handful of sticks or a couple boxes during that period, but they crowd in there regularly just to smoke those couple sticks, do you really think he's turning a profit? And profit is the only reason to be in business. And he is a business, not a free place to lounge and kill time.

Three, one statement you made makes wonder what your motivation for posting really is. Why do you think he's "punishing the public" (your words)? Short of violating civil rights he is under no obligation to do business with anybody. It seems like you're taking this personal, and not as a business decision. If you don't like that decision by all means show your displeasure by using your wallet elsewhere. But don't punish him with unfounded statements.

I'm in no way trying to say it's right or wrong. Good decisions or bad, it's, in the end, his business and his money to do with as he pleases. Without fully knowing the specific Financials of the business you really can't make a judgement on his intentions.

I buy as many sticks as I plan to smoke of mine on a given night that I bring with me. If I plan to smoke 4, I buy 4. (I use them for bombs)

You have to look at it from the other side, if it were your lounge, would you want guys bringing in their own sticks, tying up one of your money making seats for 2-6 hours and not make a dime off them???? Now, box buying customers, maybe a different story, at least you know they spend money there.

We have a lounge here that has a private access lounge on the other half of the store. It is $240 a month and you get a $200 credit towards purchases and a locker. Might sound like its stupid expensive, but all they are doing is making you pre pay for your sticks, and making sure you purchase there.

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Originally Posted by jp1979

I buy as many sticks as I plan to smoke of mine on a given night that I bring with me. If I plan to smoke 4, I buy 4. (I use them for bombs)

You have to look at it from the other side, if it were your lounge, would you want guys bringing in their own sticks, tying up one of your money making seats for 2-6 hours and not make a dime off them???? Now, box buying customers, maybe a different story, at least you know they spend money there.

We have a lounge here that has a private access lounge on the other half of the store. It is $240 a month and you get a $200 credit towards purchases and a locker. Might sound like its stupid expensive, but all they are doing is making you pre pay for your sticks, and making sure you purchase there.

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Really nothing wrong with that, except keep in mind his profit margin on higher end sticks may be more than the low end cigars. $240 per month for a clean, quiet, and comfortable place to smoke $200 worth of cigars may seem expensive, but when you seriously look at your cigar budget, how far off is that from what you spend now? Sure, I can go on-line and pick up more sticks than I'd get at this lounge for that $240, but if I'm sitting on my deck in 90 degree heat, or below freezing temps, that extra cash for a warm/cool place to smoke in a comfy leather chair, with the ball game on a big screen, is, IMHO, worth the extra costs. Like I said before, everything's a trade-off.